California Surveyors Forums

AB 645 has been chaptered.
The Governor signed it October 11, 2009, and it was filed with the Seretary of State October 11, 2009.

It will become effective on January 1, 2010. We will no longer need to include license expiration date on stamps, plans and maps in approving the documents.

My stamp has space and I will continue to write in the Exp. date.

I would rather see the government revise the wording to show the Renewal Date, rather than an Expiration Date.

My 0.02

"I have never seen the advantage of adding an expiration date to the stamp. "

Robert, my opinion is; when I review a map and confirm the surveyor still has a valid license, it is his/her affidavit they are practicing in good standings (and a technicallity), end of license review.

With no expiration date on the map, shouldn't the map checker look to see if the name and license number actually match the Board's records, or trust the individual who submitted it? What affivit is on the map other than a signature. Maybe Joe Smith signed the map and used LS No. 8075. Shouldn't I check to see if they match, at a minimum? If they don't match, how did the map get filed from a fraudulant surveyor?

Just playing devils advacate, looking at all posibilities to strengthen our profession.

so Keith, do you want to do a signature analysis too?
Should the surveyor personally appear with proper ID?
What about proof of citizenship?
A DNA sample?

Seriously, if there is something that jumps out at you, check it out... but there are probably more important issues

Keith,

Why would the presence of an expiration date on the stamp change anything w.r.t. you "devil's advocate" statement?

If you are inclined to check the BPELS database without the date, shouldn't you do so if a date is present? After all, this unscupulous individual might be writing in a phony date!

I see no down side to doing away with the exp. date and can see at least a couple of up sides.

1. One less bit of ink to drag my hand through when I sign/stamp a map or doc (I'm left handed), or, for those who buy their stamps with the date imprinted rather than a blank, no need to buy a new one every 2 years.

2. No calls from the county planning staff who is just getting around, a month after my renewal date, to reviewing the descriptions I turned in with a BLA a month before my renewal date, telling me that the descriptions are no good because my license is expired.

Just attempting to check your maps to be "Technically Correct".
Is a valid license a technicality that should or should not be checked?

If you get pulled over by the police, don't they check the validity of your license?

Now back to our regularly scheduled map reviews. I'm done here.

"If you get pulled over by the police, don't they check the validity of your license?"

I know most of the police in my area. And besides, I let my 11 year old do the driving now, and they know she doesn't have a license, so they don't ask!



My previous point is that whether or not there is an expiration date shouldn't have any bearing on whether or not you check the validity of a license. Either check it as SOP, or check it only if something sets off a flag for you. The changes per this bill should not affect what you are currently doing in this regard.

"If you get pulled over by the police, don't they check the validity of your license?"

You bet!

Now if they start stopping everybody "just to check" I am gonna get REAL POed and tell them to quit wasting my money.

inclusion of the "expiration date" on the seal was to remind the holder of the license that his renewal FEES are due. Ka Ching. This was twenty years ago or so.

I hated the "expiration date" Also. . . . this happens as you get older.

Only problem I had with it, was wet signing 30 copies of an ALTA. everyone of those dudes needed the renewal date and date of signature.

Then if someone caught a little error on say a plat that went with a legal desc. Now ? do I fudge yesterdays date on the corrected plat ? or print and resign the whole dang-blasted pkg.
Not trying to be sloppy, but time is money. (not to us, but to someone needing that bank loan)

Ollar F Ueerme

I am certain that the cost of resubmitting documents because of expired dates on license stamps FAR outwieghs the horrendous possibility of a "lapsed" licensee filing maps.

Point of Imnformation: Do those in the checking world also check to make sure that the document was submitted by the person whose license/registration number appears on the document? Do you also check to make sure that the number is valid to start with?

"those in the checking world"

hehe i too think they're on another planet sometimes

Ian said, "those in the checking world", . . . you are correct, I am from Mars!
Why do you think we use red ink for revisions, heheheee!!!

The following sections of the SMA for public agency certificates/statements still call out the need to indicate the license expiration date. In my County, we will be recognizing the intent of the bill and modifying the standard certificates for parcel maps and final maps accordingly.

TRACT MAPS

66442. (a) If a subdivision for which a final map is required lies
within an unincorporated area, a certificate or statement by the
county surveyor is required. If a subdivision lies within a city, a
certificate or statement by the city engineer or city surveyor is
required. The appropriate official shall sign, date, and, below or
immediately adjacent to the signature, indicate his or her
registration or license number with expiration date and the stamp of
his or her seal, state that:
(1) He or she has examined the map.
(2) The subdivision as shown is substantially the same as it
appeared on the tentative map, and any approved alterations thereof.

(3) All provisions of this chapter and of any local ordinances
applicable at the time of approval of the tentative map have been
complied with.
(4) He or she is satisfied that the map is technically correct.

PARCEL MAPS

66450. (a) If a subdivision for which a parcel map is required lies
within an unincorporated area, a certificate or statement by the
county surveyor is required. If a subdivision lies within a city, a
certificate or statement by the city engineer or city surveyor is
required. The appropriate official shall sign, date, and, below or
immediately adjacent to the signature, indicate his or her
registration or license number with expiration date and the stamp of
his or her seal and state that:
(1) He or she examined the map.
(2) The subdivision as shown is substantially the same as it
appeared on the tentative map, if required, and any approved
alterations thereof.
(3) All provisions of this chapter and of any local ordinances
applicable at the time of approval of the tentative map, if required,
have been complied with.
(4) He or she is satisfied that the map is technically correct.

Dennis,

At the Board offices, we have someone reviewing the PLS / PE Acts and Board Rules and preparing rulemaking proposals.

Ric